Talk:Yoritomo
Yoritomo's Youth In case of any questions as to how the dates of Yoritomo's youth section were derived: 1) Yoritomo becomes champion in 1117 following his father's death. - 3e p. 17 2) Yoritomo is ten when his father dies. - Storms 3) Yoritomo was three when his mother and brothers died. - Storms i.e Yoritomo was born in 1107. i.e. They died in 1110. --Majushi 12:32, 19 October 2007 (UTC) :This also means that he was six when he instigated the Battle of Ice and Snow (WC:KS, I believe). It also means that this is a child of about sixteen. I'm fairly certain I also remember references to his white hair prior to his death... at the age of 26. The 3E timeline has to be wrong. 05:47, 20 October 2007 (UTC) : The 3e timeline is wrong. This will be corrected in 4e. ~Rob Hobart, 4e Line Editor :: The Great Clans page 145 claims it was 1100 when Yoritomo's mother and brothers died. I will change as much as possible all the related wiki articles to match this canon fact. Oni no Pikachu (talk) 16:49, May 3, 2014 (UTC) Yoritomo "Kami" Why was the part about Yoritomo being a Kami removed?Dapperdanman1983 17:31, 14 November 2008 (UTC) : Because he isn't one. The Kami are the ten children of Amaterasu and Onnotangu. Simply put, I will never. Ever. Accept the word Kami being used about Yoritomo without direct confirmation from the Story Team. All I read in the fiction was that he was allowed to remain because the Thunder Dragon gave up it's place. Not because Yoritomo was named Kami of the Mantis Clan. --Majushi 09:43, 17 November 2008 (UTC) ::I agree with you. Just following tourney outline, but if they don't say it I'm happy to just think "fortune" instead.Dapperdanman1983 14:22, 17 November 2008 (UTC) :::What tournament result was this? Until otherwise Yoritomo will be the "exception to the rule" in my book. --Majushi 14:43, 17 November 2008 (UTC) ::::Scuse me. I meant temptation outline. It's on jadehand.com. 18:58, 17 November 2008 (UTC) :::Right. The temptation might say "Kami in all but Birth", but the fiction doesn't use this term. There are numerous times when story prizes and stories don't turn out exactly the same way. As such, Yoritomo is still only in the heavens thanks to the sacrifice of the Thunder Dragon. And not a Kami. --Majushi 10:10, 18 November 2008 (UTC) :::FYI: Shawn has directly confirmed that Yoritomo is a Kami... http://www.kyuden-mantis.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=54145&highlight=kami#54145 :::forgive me if I don't take that post as 100% proof. See my post below in the Fortune section. He's treated as a Kami (probably mainly by the Mantis). He is not a Kami (10 kids of A&O) or kami (elemental spirits). --Majushi 07:53, September 29, 2010 (UTC) Fortune "The Mantis are so in tune with the Kami of Thunder and the clan’s founder Fortune – Yoritomo - that Thunder is almost like a sixth element for them." Celestial Clan Themes - Mantis If this can be used as evidence, Yoritomo should be classified as a Fortune. "Kami in all but birth" could simply be interpreted to mean that he has more power and a higher status than the average Fortune (as he's allowed to represent the Mantis at the Celestial Court). Taelohn 16:10, 15 May 2009 (UTC) :Hmm... I'd like an source like a canon story or RPG book stating that Yoritomo's officially recognized as either a "Kami of Thunder" or "Fortune of ". Until then, I think that letting it remain that he is allowed to stay in the Heavens due to the Dragon of Thunder's sacrifice will have to do. --Majushi 11:43, 18 May 2009 (UTC) :: I agree, but I don't think "Kami of Thunder" was meant to refer to him anyway - it was likely supposed to be "kami of Thunder" (the spirits). When referring to their connection to the element, it would be odd to mention Yoritomo twice and them not at all (and stranger still to call him both a Kami and a Fortune). Taelohn 17:35, 18 May 2009 (UTC) :Yeah. I must admit that Yoritomo is a slight pet peeve of mine. He's cool and all, but I'm wary of fanboyism. Perhaps more than I should be. But hey... I generally wait until something is right there in writing before being too specific with his page. You'd never know what this page would end up claiming if we didn't have a little patience... I appreciate a more unbiased view of things however... So thanks for that. --Majushi 18:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC) In light of several CCG Cards referencing Yoritomo having the keyword "Kami" in the title, flavor or keyword block (Shrine to Yoritomo, Yoritomo's Guidance, Yoritomo Ascends) along with a character referring to him as a Kami in a weekly fiction I'm re-inputing mention of Yoritomo as being a Kami. :To be fair, that's the Mantis calling him a Kami. Let's get this clear. He is not a) one of the ten sons of Amaterasu and Onnotangu known as the Kami or b)one of the five elemental spirits known as kami. He has been elevated to a higher status in the heavens thanks to the Thunder Dragon's sacrifice. The Mantis will call him a Kami (because they love him). The rest of the Empire would consider him a venerated ancestor who has been granted special leave to remain in the heavens. He is "considered" a Kami. He is not actually a Kami. Or Fortune. I think we can all agree he has not been elevated to Fortune hood. --Majushi 07:51, September 29, 2010 (UTC)